Repository navigation
Please remove mitsuhiko/* #127
Description
Activity
Now, we can't remove repositories from the list, but you can turn off notifications for your projects and put a message saying you don't like this way of funding on your projects pages. ( like here https://tip4commit.com/github/django/django ) Would it be enough?
You can find your projects here https://tip4commit.com/projects/search?utf8=%E2%9C%93&query=mitsuhiko&order=balance (nobody has funded them yet)
I'm not at all okay with what you guys are doing, just for the record. The only reason I discovered this is because someone forked your project and on another website money was accumulated. They did find a way to disable it: sigmike#110
Would it be enough?
No. Not at all. Please add support for blacklisting projects. I do not want to be associated with this kind of thing.
@mitsuhiko thanks for your feedback but you are not asociated with this (if some site publishes info about your projects that doesn't mean you are associated with it).
Please add support for blacklisting projects.
Could you please explain the motivation behind this requested feature?
We are doing the following:
- we distribute the public information about opensource projects and their contributors
- we enable anybody to tip contributors of these projects
What is wrong with it?
You are collecting money using the project's name.
Furthermore you're notifying new contributors about the possibility to recieve money for their commit as soon as their pull requests are merged. In your current notification emails there is no implication that this might be a process not endorsed by the project maintainers -- in fact, your terse messages make people assume tip4commit was explicitly set up and endorsed by the maintainers, because nobody assumes an unendorsed third-party service would send such intrusive messages on their own.
Thanks for your coments, @untitaker . I think I understand the problem now.
The main problem is that some people might think that we organize crowdfunding process on behalf of project maintainers.
But we don't claim we do, that is an unintendend consequence of how we designed the system, sorry if it caused troubles.
Do you think it can be fixed by just explicitly stating that we are not affiliated with the project we collect funds for and that project maintainers might not endorse this practice?
That would certainly fix one problem, but of course i can't speak for @mitsuhiko. IIRC it was also not obvious in those messages whether the user would recieve more emails for further commits, or if there is any action at all needed to opt out of all of this.
But nevertheless i think tip4commit should be opt-in instead, because i consider the current tactic to be a very intrusive form of growth-hacking.
Email notification happens only when contributor's balance hits the threshold of 0.005 btc (that is ~2$ at current rate). Recepient needs to know that s/he received money at least once so that s/he specifies his/her bitcoin address to receive them without notification in future. And of course it is easy to unsubscribe. See https://github.com/tip4commit/tip4commit/blob/master/app/models/tip.rb#L115-L118 for details.
Can you please remove the projects? Can't be that hard to do. I really do not see much that should be discussed about this issue.
@mitsuhiko, everybody who visits pages devoted to your projects (https://tip4commit.com/github/mitsuhiko/werkzeug and https://tip4commit.com/github/mitsuhiko/flask) now sees a big red warning and hopefully understands that you are not affiliated with tip4commit.
Somebody added your projects to our database, I don't see much sense in removing them since anybody can add them back. Perhaps there should be a "black list" that prevents certain projects from being added. But I am not yet sure if we should develop this feature since motivation is not clear to me.
Why should we forbid people to send bitcoin donations to support open source project development or to receive donations for commiting to it?
I agree that it would be nice to explicitly warn users that we are not affiliated with project maintainers (to prevent confusion as @untitaker said). But currently it is quite obvious for the mentioned projects due to the warnings. Are your concerns resolved?
Why should we prevent people from sending bitcoin donations to open source project and from receiving donations for commiting to it?
Because people don't want them. Any donation that comes to me for instance I need to declare in my taxes and I need to provide information about where that is coming from. Accepting money at random is not exactly making my life easier especially when it comes out of things like bitcoin.
But aside from that, there are channels in which projects can be supported and those projects usually open them up themselves. Having random websites on the internet collect money on project's behalf is not okay in my book.
Instead of just subscribing projects make marketing and let projects sign up. That's what gittip does, that's how patreon do etc. And they also come with support for dealing with the paperwork.
Are your concerns resolved?
I can already see that this is an downhill battle so I will just accept the current proposed solution …this sounds like a feature request to me - here are some suggestions for features that could be added to tip4commit
- only the repo owner or organization admins could be allowed to register their projects on tip4commit
- there could be a "remove project and withdraw funds" feature accessible only to the repo owner or organization admins
- individual users could opt out of receiving tips and tip4commit could publish this voluntary blacklist so that project maintainers could reject contributions from anyone who is not on that list - bear in mind that receiving tips is already on an opt-in basis - one must register a bitcoin address with tip4commit before any funds will be transfered
but regardless of any of these features - if the project source code is publicly available under a standard open source license than it is obviously not possible (not technically nor legally) to prevent someone from cloning such a project and giving tips for contributions to their clone - contributions from which the original repo would not benefit - unless the author crafts a more restrictive license that specifically discourages rewarding contributions they have not much to say on the matter
keep in mind that tip4commit is itself an open source project and someone would need to take the time to implement these features - the OP is so far the only person who desires such features so perhaps the OP would care to implement some of them
the OP is so far the only person who desires such features so perhaps the OP would care to implement some of them
No, the OP isn't the only one, the Django project would be another one. And your suggestion that we should implement those features to not get spammed or affiliated with sites we don't want to be affiliated seems like a bad joke to me.
im just saying someone has to do it and that wont happen unless it is clearly a desirable feature - i would work on it myself if i thought it would be generally appreciated - which is why i framed the issue as a feature request
79 remaining items
@RapiLabs my apologies, I did not notice that was a recent addition. As for my association, I am just someone that likes the service, I have no direct ties to Tip4Commit outside of commenting here and donating on the site.
This is my profile on Tip4Commit:
https://coingiving.com/sponsors/174-blkswan+1 on everyone pushing for this to be opt-in only. it is highly inappropriate to involve projects without explicit consent.
@chx we are raising money to tip any individuals who contribute to the project, that's not about raising money to some particular individual. if contributor doesn't claim money, the'll be returned to the donation pool. what's wrong with that?
@arsenische Yes, so an individual contributor can sign up claiming/showing his contribution to different projects? Why isn't that feature there?
You are currently forcing all contributors in a project to get involved. Why can't you see that?
If somebody wants to reward independent contributors of random opensource project, does he or she needs a permission from project maintainers? Should project maintainers have the power over economic activities of other people?
This is not only about project maintainers. You don't have the consent of the individual contributors either. Make it an opt-in system and all concerns raised here will disappear.
After looking at Flattrs business model, i now think that tip4commit doesn't necessarily have to become opt-in. Flattr offers to collect money too -- the main difference between it and tip4commit is that Flattr doesn't actually withdraw money until the project maintainer actually claims it. Another difference is that Flattr doesn't send any unsolicited mails.
@arsenische: You're fighting a losing battle, here. The internet disagrees with your stance. That's not a good place to be for an internet-based service.
Please just bow to inevitability and respect for the open-source community by making it opt-in, as very nearly everyone in this thread wants you to. At the very, very least, you must provide an easy way to opt-out.
@arsenische If there's anything to take away from this experience, is that you should listen to the community. Fighting against it raises suspicions that there are ulterior motives.
Make it an opt-in system and all concerns raised here will disappear.
Much of the functionality of the service would also disappear.
@arsenische I have been following this discussion from the beginning (in HN too). I feel both sad and angry about the arguments you make towards the people who are disagreeing with you. The problem is, you cannot use a developer's name, or any trademark to get people to pay you, without the actual person's consent. Whether it goes to the payee or not, is irrelevant.
@arsenische I will reiterate what I have asked for in #146. I am an individual developer making a request on behalf of my individual self. I do not want to receive "tips" from your "service". You do not have the right to attempt to list me/opt me in to your "service" without my consent. You do not have my consent. I do not want to receive emails about "tips" from your "service". I do not want you to collect money on my behalf.
I do not know how to state it more clearly than this. I want my individual personal name out of your listings, I never want it to appear there again, and I want to be permanently removed from your "service".
You are failing to display the good faith asked of you in #146.
- If community is against the site, I am sure @AlexandrZ and me will come to a decision to kill it and make all we can to return unused funds or donate to charity.
- If there are certain issues that can be fixed without breaking the system - we should fix them.
- I personally think that tickets like Make this opt-in like Gratipay or similar services #152 break the system, but if there is consensus on that - let's be it.
Edit: created #157 to address p.1
Edit2: replied to @ubernostrum 's #146
Edit3: removed mitsuhiko/* as requested
I think it is a good idea to create a separate issue for each problem you see and continue discussion on that particular issue. We went too far from "Please remove mitsuhiko" and @mitsuhiko closed this ticket already.
- locked and limited conversation to collaborators
on Nov 1, 2014
Please remove my repositories from the website and do not add a way to add them again. I do not value third party websites gameifying my projects.